On Friday afternoon, I recorded a podcast with George F. Will — a Q&A, here. His latest column is a humdinger, on the subject of Vivek Ramaswamy. My own latest column begins with Ramaswamy too, and a quotation from Richard Brookhiser: “The presidency is not an entry-level political job, unless you’ve won a world war.”
Near the beginning of our podcast, Will tells me a story:
My good friend Tony La Russa, the baseball manager, is a great admirer of Howard Schultz, the CEO of Starbucks. And Howard Schultz, a few years ago, was thinking seriously about running for president. And Tony said, “Don’t you think he’d make a good president?” I said, “Well, Tony, could he manage the St. Louis Cardinals?” And Tony said, “No, no, no: That requires special knowledge and experience and instincts developed over the years.”
Well, hello? That’s a pretty good description of politics at the highest level of our country.
Will further recalls Bill Clinton — who “showed the tremendous strength that comes from being incapable of being embarrassed.” As for Vivek Ramaswamy, he “shows the tremendous strength that comes from not caring whether what you say is true.”
Ramaswamy is one of the many who disparage Volodymyr Zelensky, the president of Ukraine. Indeed, many have made a hate-figure out of him. Will admires him, and he cites Harvey Mansfield: The purpose of education is to learn how to praise. You learn what standards of excellence are.
“I’m sure that Zelensky, being a human being,” says Will, “has lots of faults. He also has risen to the occasion.” When the Kremlin launched its full-scale assault on Ukraine, in February 2022, the United States offered Zelensky safe passage out of the country. Zelensky said, “I don’t need a ride, I need ammunition.” “I’m sorry,” says Will, “that’s Churchillian. And it’s beautiful.”
Will continues,
For years, Americans have said, “We don’t want to fight for other people. We want them to fight their own wars.” Well, look, they’re doing that. Churchill said in the darkest days of the Blitz, “Give us the tools, and we will finish the job.”
What the United States has given the Ukrainians, says Will, amounts to a very small percentage of our defense budget. “The idea that we can’t do this and defend the border is preposterous.”
But
the most preposterous thing of all is to hear a progressive trope coming out of the mouths of conservatives, to wit, “Let’s take the money we’re giving to Kyiv and spend it on our cities.” Now, that’s just buying in to the progressive idea that what ails our cities is an insufficiency of money, which is of course exactly what progressives say at all times about everything. So, I don’t know what’s ailing these conservatives. Partly it is, of course, that whatever Joe Biden is for, this particular kind of reactive conservative is against.
Later in our conversation, we discuss abortion, drug legalization, and affirmative action. And baseball, especially one Shohei Ohtani. And books.
Not long ago, I surveyed readers, asking, “What books made an impression on you, politically? What books helped shaped your worldview?” For the resulting piece, go here.
I put the same question to George Will. He says,
I’ll give you two, just off the top of my head, and they’re both by Straussians — one an East Coast Straussian and one from the West Coast. Famously at daggers drawn.
The East Coast Straussian is Walter Berns, who wrote Freedom, Virtue, and the First Amendment. He makes an argument that I don’t fully or even largely accept, but he makes it so well, he made me think. His argument is that virtue is a legitimate interest of the state, and it can be undone by a misunderstanding of free expression, of the importance of free speech.
The second book — and here I speak as a boy from Central Illinois — is Harry Jaffa’s Crisis of the House Divided, which is about the Lincoln–Douglas debates, but is really about Lincoln.
At the end of our podcast, we talk about Jim Buckley — James L. Buckley — who passed away last week at the age of 100. Will has something in common with Bill Buckley — well, many things, but one of them is that, in addition to cherishing Jim (natch), they cherished Pat Moynihan, who beat Jim in the 1976 Senate campaign. (Awkward.)
Will tells a story about that campaign. When the general election began, Jim repeatedly referred to his opponent as “Professor Moynihan,” letting everyone know that he was a professor from Harvard. “Professor Moynihan” this, “Professor Moynihan” that.
“Pat drew himself up to his considerable height,” Will recounts, “and said, ‘The mudslinging has begun.’” Will concludes, “Those were the days, Jay.”
A visit with George F. Will is a pleasure and an education. Again, for this new podcast, go here.